How Do The Melvins Rank In The "Loudness Wars"?

[Bro Hammer]

I don't wanna get off topic but one of those Stoner Witch type albums for me that imo is recorded well and sounds amazing is the first QOTSA album.

Joe Barresi made the first Qotsa album too.

Ha! Well there ya go! I did not know that. Makes total sense now.

[meezer]

I don't wanna get off topic but one of those Stoner Witch type albums for me that imo is recorded well and sounds amazing is the first QOTSA album.

Joe Barresi made the first Qotsa album too.

Ha! Well there ya go! I did not know that. Makes total sense now.

I hadn't been listening to that one very much anymore, but when I saw
Josh on Anthony Bourdain's No Reservations (cable show)
they were playing that album exclusively (probably because it's an indie release).
Set against the high desert of SoCal, it never sounded better.
Great fucking album!

[Captain CoryCory]

I have to question if this album is really up to snuff.

They said 13 sounds fine by their standard but every reviewer cried foul at Rubin for brickwalling.

[Rusty Shackleford]

They said 13 sounds fine by their standard but every reviewer cried foul at Rubin for brickwalling.

That's Rubin's m.o., to make everything as loud as possible at every stage of the process.  That style of production certainly gets attention, but to me it's not beneficial to real music lovers.  There are stories from engineers on his projects about how he'd show up to listen to a mix and his only demand would be to make everything louder.  Something has to give when one does that, and the thing to give is usually the listener's ears and long-term interest. 

[Dumpster D]

Look, Digital itself is harsh and COLD and a lot of people dont *get it* when we are talking about LISTENING FATIGUE!!!

THIS IS WHAT SHOULD BE THE REAL FOCUS!

I can listen to Cassettes and LPs from the 70s for Days on end and its nice and warm...I listen to about 4 CDs at work a night at ANY VOLUME! and thats enough for my brain right there, more than that is punishing myself.



LISTENING FATIGUE!

[oldies radio]

amen. hallelujah, brother! 

[Bro Hammer]

Look, Digital itself is harsh and COLD and a lot of people dont *get it* when we are talking about LISTENING FATIGUE!!!

THIS IS WHAT SHOULD BE THE REAL FOCUS!

I can listen to Cassettes and LPs from the 70s for Days on end and its nice and warm...I listen to about 4 CDs at work a night at ANY VOLUME! and thats enough for my brain right there, more than that is punishing myself.



LISTENING FATIGUE!

I call bullshit. It's in your head. You're convinced that digital sucks and analog doesn't when in fact these days there's really no difference. It's subjective. Whatever you decide to sound better your head is gonna agree regardless if there really is a difference or not. The only argument there's to be had is that analog provides full spectrum where as digital does not. Those frequencies are ones that we can't hear although our brain can. Some say the reason analog sounds better is because we're hearing the frequencies that can't be heard on a digital recording. In turn when we listen to digital our brains may get "angry" due to the lack of full spectrum sound. Although I think that's kinda bullshit too. I think that in reality the only reason digital sound bothers you is because you told yourself it does. Using new techniques and processing, I don't believe for a second that someone can tell the difference aside from the noise caused by analog recording.

[LuckMach3]

Look, Digital itself is harsh and COLD and a lot of people dont *get it* when we are talking about LISTENING FATIGUE!!!

THIS IS WHAT SHOULD BE THE REAL FOCUS!

I can listen to Cassettes and LPs from the 70s for Days on end and its nice and warm...I listen to about 4 CDs at work a night at ANY VOLUME! and thats enough for my brain right there, more than that is punishing myself.



LISTENING FATIGUE!

I call bullshit. It's in your head. You're convinced that digital sucks and analog doesn't when in fact these days there's really no difference. It's subjective. Whatever you decide to sound better your head is gonna agree regardless if there really is a difference or not. The only argument there's to be had is that analog provides full spectrum where as digital does not. Those frequencies are ones that we can't hear although our brain can. Some say the reason analog sounds better is because we're hearing the frequencies that can't be heard on a digital recording. In turn when we listen to digital our brains may get "angry" due to the lack of full spectrum sound. Although I think that's kinda bullshit too. I think that in reality the only reason digital sound bothers you is because you told yourself it does. Using new techniques and processing, I don't believe for a second that someone can tell the difference aside from the noise caused by analog recording.

I agree.  I distinctively remember buying plenty of cds over the years and never felt fatigue.  I remember experiencing a ton of joy when I first bought A Senile Animal on cd and listened to it about 20 times in one day.

[(the) Razor]

Yeah, I think a blind test would be hard to tell. You can tell the difference between 192kbs mp3 and a CD on a decent stereo but I never heard the difference between FLAC and 320kbs on a blind test. I'd wager vinyl and flac in abx test would possibly be audible but then again the formats are usually mastered differently anyway without brickwalling which might play a role in the listening fatigue.

I think tapes and vinyl obviously have an amazing physical textile and emotional nostalgic attachments to ot that you cannot and will never ever get with streaming or mp3s. I love the convenience of a Google Music stream account too, but there is no doubt that digital does cheapen music.

I always buy Melvin's though. Subscribed to them for life!

[meezer]

This is the thing I just can't buy into over at the Tapeheads forum. Tens of thousands of guys, talking like this. I love cassettes. I'm hip to vinyl. But there's definitely some groupthink going on. Are most  CD versions of albums just engineered and/ or produced in a hideous fashion? Yes. Is music itself a total loss, if analogue production is completely behind us? No.

[Dumpster D]

wow, Ok...Wow...

Thanks, makes me feel really good that You tell me im full of shit.

I guess all those books I read were wrong about those entire Chapters on listening fatigue.

Sorry man.

[meezer]

Wow!

Ok...Well then its bullshit.

sorry for ever having an opinion.

It's a valid opinion. I just haven't experienced the fatigue. And I'm listening to YouTube on headphones, for hours every morning. I just think my hearing is shot, no offense to your brother.
Go run a backhoe for six hours a day. Even with earplugs, you'd be begging to hear digital music instead.

[Dumpster D]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Listener_fatigue

Im out.

But please do not put words in my mouth!

I am NOT NOR DID I EVER SAY that I was convinced digital sucks.

Sorry but I never said that anywhere EVER! But you are free to Jump to those conclusions if you must to call me out on it.

[meezer]

Some thread huh?   

[Bro Hammer]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Listener_fatigue

Im out.

But please do not put words in my mouth!

I am NOT NOR DID I EVER SAY that I was convinced digital sucks.

Sorry but I never said that anywhere EVER! But you are free to Jump to those conclusions if you must to call me out on it.

The very first paragraph of your backing proof is pretty uh, proofless....
I took the liberty of pointing out some of the important parts, after all it is Wikipedia.
"Listener fatigue (also known as listening fatigue) is a phenomenon that occurs after prolonged exposure to an auditory stimulus. Symptoms include tiredness, discomfort, pain, and loss of sensitivity. Listener fatigue is not a clinically recognized state, but is a term used by many professionals. The cause for listener fatigue is still not yet fully understood. It is thought to be an extension of the quantifiable psychological perception of sound. Common groups at risk of becoming victim to this phenomenon include avid listeners of music and others who listen or work with loud noise on a constant basis, such as musicians, construction workers and military"

I didn't read the rest of the entry because I'm pretty sure it's just full of more speculation than evidence.

ALSO I DIDN'T PUT WORDS IN YOUR MOUTH. IT'S CALLED INSINUATING AND THE WAY YOU TALK ABOUT DIGITAL VS ANALOG WOULD LEAD ANY PERSON WITH A MONKEY BRAIN TO INSINUATE YOUR FEELINGS ON THE MATTER AT HAND.

Some thread huh?   

I get listeners fatigue when I listen to records and cassettes. To much movement involved. Flipping albums and cassettes is a real work out!